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There are 10 messages in this issue.
Topics in today's digest:
1. Re: Introduction
From: "Weiers Coetser" <weiersc@xxxx.xx.xxx
2. Re: Introduction
From: "Mashudu Ravhengani" <Ravhenmj@xxxxx.xxxx
3. Re: Prayer Request
From: "Mashudu Ravhengani" <Ravhenmj@xxxxx.xxxx
4. Introduction
From: "Mashudu Ravhengani" <Ravhenmj@xxxxx.xxxx
5. Re: Introduction
From: "Andrew Modise" <ModisMA1@xxxxxx.xx.xxx
6. Introduction
From: Ramo Mekoa <ramom@xxx.xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx
7. RE: Introduction
From: Ramo Mekoa <ramom@xxx.xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx
8. Do we still need Pastors?
From: Jongimpi Papu <j.d.papu@xxxx.xx.xxx
9. Sermons and other Spiritual Food
From: "Lulama R. Zantsi" <wels124@xxxxxxx.xxx.xxx.xxx
10. RE: Do we still need Pastors?
From: Ramo Mekoa <ramom@xxx.xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx
_______________________________________________________________________________
_______________________________________________________________________________
Message: 1
Date: Mon, 18 Oct 1999 14:06:03 +0200
From: "Weiers Coetser" <weiersc@xxxx.xx.xxx
Subject: Re: Introduction
My name is Weiers
I am a pastor in the Pietermaritzburg Area of Kwa Zulu Natal.
I studied at Helderberg College (Graduated 1996)
I am currently studying for a Theological Masters Degree in Leadership and Development at the University of Natal (Pietermaritzburg). The stress is rather high as exams are around the corner and assignment due dates are approaching. (This is the reason why I am mostly a silent member of the family)
I got married three weeks ago... To Simone. She is currenlty working as an educational officer for the a NGO in Howick - "The Wildlife and Environment Society"... We are still in the honeymoon phase and that is another reason why I am generally silent online.
-------
My specific interests at the moment is the church and relevant social action. What are the possibilities and challenges for the future.
_______________________________________________________________________________
_______________________________________________________________________________
Message: 2
Date: Mon, 18 Oct 1999 09:45:28 -0400
From: "Mashudu Ravhengani" <Ravhenmj@xxxxx.xxxx
Subject: Re: Introduction
Weiers,
Congratuulations!!!, on your wedding,
May the Lord bless your marriage!
He is coming soon!
Jeremiah
>>> "Weiers Coetser" <weiersc@mweb.co.za> 10/18 8:06 AM >>>
My name is Weiers
I am a pastor in the Pietermaritzburg Area of Kwa Zulu Natal.
I studied at Helderberg College (Graduated 1996)
I am currently studying for a Theological Masters Degree in Leadership and Development at the University of Natal (Pietermaritzburg). The stress is rather high as exams are around the corner and assignment due dates are approaching. (This is the reason why I am mostly a silent member of the family)
I got married three weeks ago... To Simone. She is currenlty working as an educational officer for the a NGO in Howick - "The Wildlife and Environment Society"... We are still in the honeymoon phase and that is another reason why I am generally silent online.
-------
My specific interests at the moment is the church and relevant social action. What are the possibilities and challenges for the future.
_______________________________________________________________________________
_______________________________________________________________________________
Message: 3
Date: Mon, 18 Oct 1999 09:57:54 -0400
From: "Mashudu Ravhengani" <Ravhenmj@xxxxx.xxxx
Subject: Re: Prayer Request
Sara,
I was really touched by your request, I just want you to know that I am praying for you, and that God is able!
Many a times in our dicussions we forget that behide the email messages there are real people facing real life issues, thank you for opening our eyes. This brings in another level of sharing that we never had in this list before, and I pray that it continues.
He is able!! I know He is able!!
Jeremiah
>>> Sara C Lourenco <slourenc@stu.hbc.ac.za> 10/18 5:49 AM >>>
From: Sara C Lourenco <slourenc@stu.hbc.ac.za>
Hi...I haven't really used this service very much since I signed up as a
member but I really would like to put in a prayer request that I want to
ask you to pray for earnestly and seriously. My dad is out of work at the
moment and it is causing a lot of stress in our family. I have been
praying a lot already but the other night I started reading Roger Morneu's
book about Incredible answers to prayer again and I was reminded of the
power of Intercessory Prayer. Please keep him and my family in your
prayers. I really believe that presenting our situation in prayer before
Jesus will bring about great changes and transformations in all of
our lives. Please pray that the Lord will touch my father's life in a
very special and meaningful way and that he will find a job that will put
Him in a position to glorify and bring praises to Him. I was just very
impressed this morning to write to all of you and ask you to do this for
us. Please join your prayers with ours.
Thank you for your faithfulness and help.
Yours in Christ
Sara
The King is even at the door!
====
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To subscribe: send a blank email sa-sda-subscribe@onelist.com
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_______________________________________________________________________________
_______________________________________________________________________________
Message: 4
Date: Mon, 18 Oct 1999 10:05:05 -0400
From: "Mashudu Ravhengani" <Ravhenmj@xxxxx.xxxx
Subject: Introduction
Friends,
It seems like most of those who are introducing themselves are the same people who participate regularly to the discussions. Where are the others?
They call me Jerry, I prefer to be called Malozwe, lately I call myself Jeremiah, my real name is Mashudu (which means lucky or blessed, I am really blessed). I was named Jeremiah by an Adventist pastor (that was his name) who lived with my parents when I was born. For many years I hated this name, but lately I fell in love with it.
I am married to Millicent from VryStaat; we have a nine-month-old baby, Gundo (victory)
They say I was born in Mamelodi, I grew up in the Northern Province , the now defunct republic of Venda. I spent some few years in Cape Town where I met quite a number of fellows who are in this list, actually I plan to scan some pictures that will expose their faces.
I then lived in Pretoria & Johannesburg for a number of years before skipping the country. We now live in Edison, New Jersey (about 60 Km from New York City). I attend the Metropolitan Church in Plainfields,NJ. When they ask me what I do, I would like to be able to say, "I am an ambassador", which country? "The New Jerusalem!"
The King is coming!
________________(choose one from the list above)
_______________________________________________________________________________
_______________________________________________________________________________
Message: 5
Date: Tue, 19 Oct 1999 08:31:39 +0200
From: "Andrew Modise" <ModisMA1@xxxxxx.xx.xxx
Subject: Re: Introduction
Brothers and Sisters,
My name is Malebo Andrew Modise, I was named after my paternal
grandfather who named his son (my father) Peter. The name Malebo means
gratitude. I am generally known as and called Andrew but since the
campus days some of the guys call me Duhla. I was born in the Diamond
City (ie Kimberley, for those who don't know). I then spent some time in
Cape Town where I met some of the members on this list. After Cape Town
I moved to Johannesburg where I still find myself today. I work for
Telkom and have the responsibility of developing information
infrastructure strategies.
I am married to Nonhlanhla (which means lucky) who's from Johannesburg.
We have a five year old daughter called Ipeleng (which means be pleased
or be proud). We gave her this name, inspired by Luke 2:52, because our
prayer is that she will grow up loving God and He will be pleased with
her and we will be proud of her in the Lord.
We attend the Katlehong Church where I'm the elder. I am also involved
with the youth and SDASA. We are planning to start a branch in Midrand
next year and your prayers will be most welcome.
"Come, let us reason together,......."
Andrew
>>> "Mashudu Ravhengani" <Ravhenmj@umdnj.edu> 10/18/99 04:05PM >>>
From: "Mashudu Ravhengani" <Ravhenmj@umdnj.edu>
Friends,
It seems like most of those who are introducing themselves are the same
people who participate regularly to the discussions. Where are the
others?
They call me Jerry, I prefer to be called Malozwe, lately I call myself
Jeremiah, my real name is Mashudu (which means lucky or blessed, I am
really blessed). I was named Jeremiah by an Adventist pastor (that was
his name) who lived with my parents when I was born. For many years I
hated this name, but lately I fell in love with it.
I am married to Millicent from VryStaat; we have a nine-month-old baby,
Gundo (victory)
They say I was born in Mamelodi, I grew up in the Northern Province ,
the now defunct republic of Venda. I spent some few years in Cape Town
where I met quite a number of fellows who are in this list, actually I
plan to scan some pictures that will expose their faces.
I then lived in Pretoria & Johannesburg for a number of years before
skipping the country. We now live in Edison, New Jersey (about 60 Km
from New York City). I attend the Metropolitan Church in Plainfields,NJ.
When they ask me what I do, I would like to be able to say, "I am an
ambassador", which country? "The New Jerusalem!"
The King is coming!
________________(choose one from the list above)
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------------------------------------------------------------------------
The King is even at the door!
====
To contribute to the discussions: send your mails to sa-sda@onelist.com
To subscribe: send a blank email sa-sda-subscribe@onelist.com
To unsubscribe: send a blank email to sa-sda-unsubscribe@onelist.com
_______________________________________________________________________________
_______________________________________________________________________________
Message: 6
Date: Tue, 19 Oct 1999 10:01:54 +0200
From: Ramo Mekoa <ramom@xxx.xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx
Subject: Introduction
Dear friends,
My name is Ramodise Mekoa. My family and most other people who know me call
me Oupa while those who got to know me later in life call me Ramo. On campus
I somehow got the name Paks, though the origins thereof are still a bit
blurry to me. I have another name which will remain unknown.
I was born in Springs, in the Far East Rand, almost thirty years ago. This
is where I did all my schooling before I went on to Cape-Town where I met
some of the members on this list. I am trained as a chemist, but left the
cutting edge of the industry last year to pursue a career in sales and
marketing.
I recently got married to Neo, who hails from Gaborone, Botswana. We
currently reside in Midrand, where we are hoping to be part of the
initiative to start a new branch. Currently I am the education/communication
secretary at the Kwa-Thema church. Your prayers for the Midrand branch
initiative will be most welcome.
He's coming soon to take His own.
Ramodise
_______________________________________________________________________________
_______________________________________________________________________________
Message: 7
Date: Tue, 19 Oct 1999 10:12:34 +0200
From: Ramo Mekoa <ramom@xxx.xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx
Subject: RE: Introduction
Jeremiah,
I thought the New Jerusalem was a city, not a country. This poses a slight
problem with your title, doesn't it? Maybe an equivalent would be PRO.
Unless of course the New Jerusalem is a city AND a country, somewhat like
the Vatican.
For old time's sake,
Ramo
-----Original Message-----
From: Mashudu Ravhengani [mailto:Ravhenmj@umdnj.edu]
Sent: Monday, October 18, 1999 16:05
To: sa-sda@onelist.com
Subject: [sa-sda] Introduction
From: "Mashudu Ravhengani" <Ravhenmj@umdnj.edu>
Friends,
It seems like most of those who are introducing themselves are the same
people who participate regularly to the discussions. Where are the others?
They call me Jerry, I prefer to be called Malozwe, lately I call myself
Jeremiah, my real name is Mashudu (which means lucky or blessed, I am really
blessed). I was named Jeremiah by an Adventist pastor (that was his name)
who lived with my parents when I was born. For many years I hated this name,
but lately I fell in love with it.
I am married to Millicent from VryStaat; we have a nine-month-old baby,
Gundo (victory)
They say I was born in Mamelodi, I grew up in the Northern Province , the
now defunct republic of Venda. I spent some few years in Cape Town where I
met quite a number of fellows who are in this list, actually I plan to scan
some pictures that will expose their faces.
I then lived in Pretoria & Johannesburg for a number of years before
skipping the country. We now live in Edison, New Jersey (about 60 Km from
New York City). I attend the Metropolitan Church in Plainfields,NJ. When
they ask me what I do, I would like to be able to say, "I am an ambassador",
which country? "The New Jerusalem!"
The King is coming!
________________(choose one from the list above)
The King is even at the door!
====
To contribute to the discussions: send your mails to sa-sda@onelist.com
To subscribe: send a blank email sa-sda-subscribe@onelist.com
To unsubscribe: send a blank email to sa-sda-unsubscribe@onelist.com
_______________________________________________________________________________
_______________________________________________________________________________
Message: 8
Date: Tue, 19 Oct 1999 10:59:34 +0200
From: Jongimpi Papu <j.d.papu@xxxx.xx.xxx
Subject: Do we still need Pastors?
Friends
I was hoping that we will not spend the whole week introducing ourselves. Remember this is an open week, where we can raise any subject. Allow me to raise one that maybe a little sensitive.
Do we really need Pastors, I mean pastors as in those who preach once a week and hold elections once a year, bury the dead and marry the saints?
I am asking this question in light of the two articles that appeared in the October Issue of Ministry on the topic of church planting. The two authors seem to agree that pastors should be in the forefront of church planting, raising new churches instead of baby sitting the already established ones.
Somewhere, it is noted that churches who still believe that they need a pastor to look after them, may be dying or have lost the vision of their mission. We know that churches in the end time will exist without pastors, I think, now is the best time to move toward that direction.
Today our Pastors are anything between Counsellors and Builders but far from what they are supposed to be, that is, Evangelists. What is your take on this subject? Do you think that your church needs a Pastor. I know of a church that has three pastors looking after it. There has been a cry for more pastors, where bigger churches have expressed a need for a pastor they will not share with other churches. Maybe Andrew can help us here, for I understand they are planning to establish a branch in Midrand. I thought Ramo has indicated keen interest in being an elder or leader of the branch.
Go Ye therefore...
Jongimpi
_______________________________________________________________________________
_______________________________________________________________________________
Message: 9
Date: Tue, 19 Oct 1999 11:39:53 +2
From: "Lulama R. Zantsi" <wels124@welspta.pwv.gov.za>
Subject: Sermons and other Spiritual Food
Brethren,
I have noted the appreciation expressed for the prayer request
received a few days back. Indeed, it added new challenges and
dimension to the site. We suddenly came to the realization that it's
not merely about skills in arguing and debating but about exhorting
one another and spiritual upliftment as well.
Equally appealing to me was the sermon or article or sermonette (call
it what you like) by Pst J. Papu on "Faith That Sees". I encourage
whoever has not read it to do so very prayerfully. I was touched in a
special way when this man of God wrote that "we all know that Enoch
was taken to heaven on a chariot but never realize that before then,
he had to walk with God for 300 years and everyday was sweeter than
the day before". The challenge is not to procrastinate things to the
remote future but to enjoy the blessings of a relationship with God
today, even eternal life for that matter. Indeed, when it comes to
prophecy - whether 666 or sealing or mark of the beast or 144 000 or
anything else, the tendency is to forget that the applications of
most are TODAY and not tomorrow.
One could say a lot ... but the bottom line is that the sermon was
real, good spiritual food for thought. This humble learner wonders
if we cannot have such sermons at regular intervals, perhaps on
Fridays to reflect on the Sabbath in a special way (or some other
time?). The same author could be asked to do the honours - may be
with some variety? I don't know how others feel about it. In fact,
I remember Zambia's Pst Lubase's point at a SDASA meeting in the
Eastern Cape when addressing the so-called "too much
sermonizing/evangelizing/spiritualizing" at SDASA meetings. He said
that he may not have been a SDASA member but if a meeting is convened
in the name of God then God must be glorified! Whatever the original
intentions for this site, this humble learner submits: "The sermons
and other forms of spiritual emphasis must continue".God bless.
To know Him and to make Him known.
Lulama
this humble learner
P.S.: I'm not merely supporting Jerry's point about Cyber evangelism
for outreach purposes but am giving my own personal experience
(testimony) as well.
_______________________________________________________________________________
_______________________________________________________________________________
Message: 10
Date: Tue, 19 Oct 1999 12:43:19 +0200
From: Ramo Mekoa <ramom@smm.setpoint.co.za>
Subject: RE: Do we still need Pastors?
Jongimpi,
I often say things that I later realise I never meant to say, but the bit
about being an elder at the yet to be established Midrand branch I'm sure I
would not have said.
About the need for pastors: I really do believe that there is still a place
for them in our churches, even the established ones. Granted some churches
are so organised that a pastor is more a 'nice to have' than an absolute
necessity. Pastors of such churches should introduce the same kind of
'self-sufficiency' in their other churches so that they can concentrate on
that very important function that you mentioned, viz.. evangelism.
I think it is a shame that there appears to be so little use of the skills
of the layperson in the church for the church. A lot of time can be freed
for the trained evangelist i.e. pastors by delegating the majority of their
administrative duties, as well as the 'babysitting' ones, to skilled laity.
After all, we're in this together.
I realise that the above may do some damage to my objection to the eldership
of the hypothetical branch in Midrand, but I am sure we can treat the two
separately.
Let's work, for the night is coming.
Ramo
-----Original Message-----
From: Jongimpi Papu [mailto:j.d.papu@mweb.co.za]
Sent: Tuesday, October 19, 1999 11:00
To: sa-sda@onelist.com
Subject: [sa-sda] Do we still need Pastors?
Friends
I was hoping that we will not spend the whole week introducing ourselves.
Remember this is an open week, where we can raise any subject. Allow me to
raise one that maybe a little sensitive.
Do we really need Pastors, I mean pastors as in those who preach once a week
and hold elections once a year, bury the dead and marry the saints?
I am asking this question in light of the two articles that appeared in the
October Issue of Ministry on the topic of church planting. The two authors
seem to agree that pastors shoul
Somewhere, it is noted that churches who still believe that they need a
pastor to look after them, may be dying or have lost the vision of their
mission. We know that churches in the end time will exist without pastors,
I think, now is the best time to move toward that direction.
Today our Pastors are anything between Counsellors and Builders but far from
what they are supposed to be, that is, Evangelists. What is your take on
this subject? Do you think that your church needs a Pastor. I know of a
church that has three pastors looking after it. There has been a cry for
more pastors, where bigger churches have expressed a need for a pastor they
will not share with other churches. Maybe Andrew can help us here, for I
understand they are planning to establish a branch in Midrand. I thought
Ramo has indicated keen interest in being an elder or leader of the branch.
Go Ye therefore...
Jongimpi
_______________________________________________________________________________
_______________________________________________________________________________
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